Using the current rules but eliminating the requirement to be '10 deg C above ambient', is it possible to get the engine plenum below ambient?
How would this be done.... remember all other rules apply.
Brian
It’s above, not below ambient.Hoffman900 wrote: ↑06 Sep 2021, 22:25You forgot the key part, 10* below ambient* over the average of one lap, but not including the first.
*ambient is measured at a weather station the FIA places somewhere, so it's not a fixed point. A large track like Spa, with elevation changes, etc., it's not going to be the same everywhere. If the weather station is in the pits, it'll likely be higher due to a localized heat island effect. It's not an instantaneous measurement, no team would pass that.
There are many ways to do it. Super cooling at the intercooler, evaporative cooling via fuel or another compound, cooling via gas expansion, cooling the plenum (though, this isn't as effective). Some are legal, some are grey, some are illegal.
I've even seen NOS or another gas sprayed on intercoolers where it was legal and made sense.
What a great documentary!!Hoffman900 wrote: ↑06 Sep 2021, 23:07Thanks for the correction. I knew that.
Air density (which comes from cooling) still matters for both. ESPECIALLY with the fuel rules F1 has.
Air isn’t "forced" or "sucked" in. All boost does is create an artificially higher atmospheric pressure. The moving piston creates a depression below atmospheric, but it’s never zero. Cam timing isn’t all that (relatively) different than a NA engine because at some point, port pressure and cylinder pressure are going to meet, it’s just at a higher value for a boosted engine, but doesn’t necessarily take more time to do so.
You can play with this in in a simulation by just changing atmospheric pressure. Cosworth in developing the GBA V6 engine, used a compressor with the BDx engine and the GBA to experiment with boost pressure, independent of having to develop the rest of the system:
About 13:00 in.
Indeed!BassVirolla wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 20:54What a great documentary!!Hoffman900 wrote: ↑06 Sep 2021, 23:07Thanks for the correction. I knew that.
Air density (which comes from cooling) still matters for both. ESPECIALLY with the fuel rules F1 has.
Air isn’t "forced" or "sucked" in. All boost does is create an artificially higher atmospheric pressure. The moving piston creates a depression below atmospheric, but it’s never zero. Cam timing isn’t all that (relatively) different than a NA engine because at some point, port pressure and cylinder pressure are going to meet, it’s just at a higher value for a boosted engine, but doesn’t necessarily take more time to do so.
You can play with this in in a simulation by just changing atmospheric pressure. Cosworth in developing the GBA V6 engine, used a compressor with the BDx engine and the GBA to experiment with boost pressure, independent of having to develop the rest of the system:
About 13:00 in.
https://youtu.be/frU7cVt_qKclio007 wrote: ↑09 Sep 2021, 09:28Indeed!BassVirolla wrote: ↑08 Sep 2021, 20:54What a great documentary!!Hoffman900 wrote: ↑06 Sep 2021, 23:07Thanks for the correction. I knew that.
Air density (which comes from cooling) still matters for both. ESPECIALLY with the fuel rules F1 has.
Air isn’t "forced" or "sucked" in. All boost does is create an artificially higher atmospheric pressure. The moving piston creates a depression below atmospheric, but it’s never zero. Cam timing isn’t all that (relatively) different than a NA engine because at some point, port pressure and cylinder pressure are going to meet, it’s just at a higher value for a boosted engine, but doesn’t necessarily take more time to do so.
You can play with this in in a simulation by just changing atmospheric pressure. Cosworth in developing the GBA V6 engine, used a compressor with the BDx engine and the GBA to experiment with boost pressure, independent of having to develop the rest of the system:
About 13:00 in.
If only the documentation was a bit longer to see how it continued.
Oh dear...feeling ashamedBassVirolla wrote: ↑09 Sep 2021, 09:36https://youtu.be/frU7cVt_qKc